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  #1  
Old 08-21-2012, 05:09 PM
boston boston is offline
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Default Future of Opel

With GM still clearly struggling to control Opel, you have to wonder whether spinning it off has value.
It was on the cards some time during the US arm's time in Chapter 11, then everything pulled back. You look at the models developed in Europe that have gotten passports to the US product lines as wonder if GM USA could survive without Opel's research and development center.

This article looks like someone raking over the ashes again. But at a certain point in time, you have to wonder if a fire will break out.

http://wardsauto.com/blog/different-plan-save-opel
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  #2  
Old 08-22-2012, 04:37 AM
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swizzle swizzle is offline
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GM doesn't need Opel and Chevy in Europe. They should make Opel an affordable brand, drop the link with PSA that is doomed to die, and get cut throat.
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  #3  
Old 08-22-2012, 07:51 AM
mick78 mick78 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swizzle View Post
GM doesn't need Opel and Chevy in Europe. They should make Opel an affordable brand, drop the link with PSA that is doomed to die, and get cut throat.
First, Opel and Chevy could work. What however would be essential is more differentiation. The Cruze and Malibu caught up, and in many respects feel exactly like an Opel (not helped by sharing basically same steering wheel and center stacck on all cars, e.g.). Pretty much what VW and Skoda have become, and VW is now trying to fight. Just GM doesn't seem to learn.

There would cleary be a place for a budget brand, just Opel would also need the products to distance itself from Chevy. And that's what GM doesn't give them.

The PSA link is more a development JV, to share costs at engine, platform and other development, plus becoming more flexible with production facilities not producing basically rebadged cars. And whilst Peugeot and Opel are indeed targeting more or less teh same crowd in Europe, Citroen is bought by people who would probably never consider anything form the GM portfolio, so shouldn't harm Opel sales....
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  #4  
Old 08-22-2012, 01:54 PM
wildeye wildeye is offline
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It's really hard for me, as a die-hard fan, to see Opel dying, but even I dislike the brand more and more.

GM's mistakes:
-that stupid US design just doesn't work here, we need own products
-they don't let Opel into growing markets
-less innovation (which was always a key position for Opel)
-they killed Opel's motorsport participation
-nearly every day a new chairman for Opel
-they don't comment on press rumours (they like to see them bleeding)
-let good officers go directly to competitors for the reason of being "american way" idiots
-no sporty cars for Opel

Opel's mistakes:
-stupid PR (false brand ambassadors, misleading ads)
-silly names for the cars

Unlucky economic situation:
-typical Opel buyer is loser of the economical crisis
-young people can't afford new cars (Opel was driven by many young people)
-people rather like to buy an used premium car than a new Opel (mostly caused by some sort of immigrants (those with 150k+ kilometers on tachometer when buying a used premium car) and domestic people adopt it to at least keep up their lifestyle) Please don't hate me for this, it's the truth here in Germany.
-competition is growing
-Opel is not seen as 100% german
-press hates Opel and is to much influenced
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  #5  
Old 08-22-2012, 03:52 PM
mick78 mick78 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wildeye View Post
Unlucky economic situation:
-typical Opel buyer is loser of the economical crisis
-young people can't afford new cars (Opel was driven by many young people)
-people rather like to buy an used premium car than a new Opel (mostly caused by some sort of immigrants (those with 150k+ kilometers on tachometer when buying a used premium car) and domestic people adopt it to at least keep up their lifestyle) Please don't hate me for this, it's the truth here in Germany.
-competition is growing
-Opel is not seen as 100% german
-press hates Opel and is to much influenced
I think you summed up the reasons for the failure of most European "bread and butter" brands.
Economy is an important thing, as the crisis hits the mid of the income spectrum hardest. Who were poor before are still poor, and the rich are still rich, or have even more, as rising sales figures of Porsche & co. show.

The thing with used premiums instead is the same here in Austria, people rather buying a used Audi A3 or A4 with 150-200k km than a new Astra. This is IMO clearly a trend in the last 10 or so years, and can be traced by declining sales figures of corresponding brands...

And of course the "Opel not seen German" argument is with special thanks to GM and their theater around 2008/2009 with selling/not selling/selling/not selling Opel. It was an example of mismanagement....
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  #6  
Old 08-23-2012, 07:25 AM
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phaeton phaeton is offline
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Its funny this thread has come up as Opel launches in Australia Saturday week.
The local car magazine had a 6 page write up on the history of Opel & the PR spin is building it up as a VW competitor.

VW (40,000) Audi, MB and BMW are the only Euro brands that crack more than 14,000 units.

Renault, Peugeot, Citroen, Skoda, Fiat barely crack 4000 units, so an unknown brand with only one hero model the Astra is going to succeed????

Possibly you could say VW did it with the Golf but the VW name is known in the Australian culture.

Will Opel succeed in one of the most competitive markets on earth? time will tell.
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  #7  
Old 08-03-2017, 08:15 PM
Tomm14 Tomm14 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swizzle View Post
GM doesn't need Opel and Chevy in Europe. They should make Opel an affordable brand, drop the link with PSA that is doomed to die, and get cut throat.

HOW can you be so mean and bad feeling with PSA like this
I've read many topics on this forum and your interventions are always to violently criticize the french brand...but why ???
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  #8  
Old 08-04-2017, 12:19 AM
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swizzle swizzle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomm14 View Post
HOW can you be so mean and bad feeling with PSA like this
I've read many topics on this forum and your interventions are always to violently criticize the french brand...but why ???
Simple really: class-trailing styling, lack of innovation, poor quality/reliability, and perpetually making the most idiotic business moves because the government will always bail them out. The automotive leaders--currently--are from Japan and South Korea with the Chinese about to school everyone. As for being "mean", that made me laugh. PSA is a company, not some ill-adjusted kid that whines. Oh wait...
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  #9  
Old 08-04-2017, 01:05 AM
boston boston is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boston View Post
With GM still clearly struggling to control Opel, you have to wonder whether spinning it off has value.
It was on the cards some time during the US arm's time in Chapter 11, then everything pulled back. You look at the models developed in Europe that have gotten passports to the US product lines as wonder if GM USA could survive without Opel's research and development center.

This article looks like someone raking over the ashes again. But at a certain point in time, you have to wonder if a fire will break out.

http://wardsauto.com/blog/different-plan-save-opel
Wow. I started this thread five years ago.....Let me check my crystal ball...for the next prediction.
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  #10  
Old 08-04-2017, 03:06 PM
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swizzle swizzle is offline
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GM needed to lose Opel as far back as the bail out. Opel has never been "essential" to GM. GM has the capacity to produce small cars without Opel. It's turned successfully to Suzuki, Isuzu, Toyota and Daewoo/GMDAT/GM Korea and been just fine.

As I said elsewhere, I predict a GM-SAIC merger.
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