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  #11  
Old 10-29-2012, 01:38 PM
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swizzle swizzle is offline
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They don't want any technology from PSA, they want to ratioalize production of midsizers by joining platforms and thus enabling production in one place at acceptable numbers (especially the Insignia/C5 segment is shrinking in Europe considerably...
Be that as it may, if you want to collaborate with another kid in class, you don't look to the C+ kid for help.

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GM was never looking to sell Opel...You can't even sell off Opel; it's 100% owned by GM. It'd be like GM selling off Chevrolet; it makes no sense and it's too intertwined with the rest of GM as a whole.
They most decidedly DID shop Opel around. They also offered Saturn and Hummer for sale as well. Saturn was just a name and there were nibbles. Hummer was nearly purchased. The sale of Opel was a topic of great concern for GM as well as the European market. At the time GM was leaning toward giving more engineering responsibility to GM South Korea for small cars.
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  #12  
Old 10-29-2012, 02:12 PM
2o6 2o6 is offline
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You can't fuse two companies together because you like them.



You don't know anything about PSA products, they haven't been sold in the US for 10+ years.
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  #13  
Old 10-29-2012, 02:22 PM
mick78 mick78 is offline
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Be that as it may, if you want to collaborate with another kid in class, you don't look to the C+ kid for help.
Problem is, that not so many great companies are available for Europe: Ford w. Opel? No way, VW, even less so; Renault is already working together with Nissan (and IMO not doing that well, as - compared to GM or VW - the cars share still to little technology to be really cost efficient) plus Mercedes coming up, Fiat has already once pulled money out from GM and is as a result surely not on their radar (plus they have Chrysler) - who is left? Hyundai/Kia could have gotten SAAB for peanuts, but don't seem to be interested in an European brand (plus they dfon't need lolume/a partner in Europe, being very successfull on their own), and from Japan, Mazda is still leaning more towards Ford and in future most likely Fiat/Alfa, Totoyta doesn't need volume, an Mitsubishi? Well, if PSA is a C+ student, what is Mitsubishi? E? F?
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  #14  
Old 10-29-2012, 05:50 PM
wildeye wildeye is offline
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Be that as it may, if you want to collaborate with another kid in class, you don't look to the C+ kid for help.
But the C+ kid is the only person who speaks to you because it's also beaten up by the others. Wanna be my friend, huh?
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  #15  
Old 10-29-2012, 07:39 PM
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Sometimes necessity is the trigger. These companies all have needs that only by swallowing their corporate prides have they been able to do this deal.
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  #16  
Old 10-31-2012, 02:28 AM
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But the C+ kid is the only person who speaks to you because it's also beaten up by the others. Wanna be my friend, huh?
But that does not make it a good idea.

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Sometimes necessity is the trigger. These companies all have needs that only by swallowing their corporate prides have they been able to do this deal.
there is no strength in mutual weakness
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  #17  
Old 10-31-2012, 03:36 AM
2o6 2o6 is offline
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Now you're just reaching.
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  #18  
Old 10-31-2012, 03:37 AM
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But that does not make it a good idea.



there is no strength in mutual weakness
i've got to ask, with your constant negativity and pessimism...why aren't you out there "fixing" these "brainless" companies? it's pretty selfish to be holding back all of your clearly superior and fool-proof ideas from the rest of us inferior beings.
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  #19  
Old 11-03-2012, 08:36 AM
sn1572 sn1572 is offline
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Originally Posted by 2o6 View Post
You don't know anything about PSA products, they haven't been sold in the US for 10+ years.
More precisely, 20 years!

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Originally Posted by mick78 View Post
They don't want any technology from PSA, they want to ratioalize production of midsizers by joining platforms and thus enabling production in one place at acceptable numbers (especially the Insignia/C5 segment is shrinking in Europe considerably; Without pulling many vehicles off from one platform, production is hardly viable) and sharing development costs of other platforms (IMO especially the CUV segment makes sense, neither the Chevy Captiva based Opek Antara nor the Mitsubishi PSA clones were really compatible with European taste).

This is a) not a merger, but a cooperation on certain vehicles/production facilities, and b)neither PSA nor GM wants a certain technology from the other, but save costs by rationalization. Probably not the most genius move, but then again it's not like alternatives are overly numerous...
Good post, mick. That's why Fiat wants to have a slice of the cake as well.

European auto industry was not ready for tough times and labor costs are high. Most factories are operating way below capacity, practice that raise costs of production, sometimes even make it unprofitable, while companies are being forced to offer discounts to get cars out of dealers. By sharing development and production costs, they will be able to compete better. I'm sure this deal will come, unfortunately, at the cost of factories being closed.

For instance, next generation Peugeot 508, Citroen C5/DS5 and Opel Insignia will probably share plataform and production line (in Germany?). Other models are going to be jointly developed, including a compact MPV (Meriva/C3 Picasso?), a compact crossover and a small car. Please correct me if I'm mistaken, but these segments are some of which are in need of a renewal or new offerings by PSA or Opel.

I must add that, at least in my personal perception, Peugeots, Citroens and Opels are very different cars and there are lots of good solutions that can be shared. This might end up working well, specially for the European market and its demands.
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