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  #21  
Old 10-25-2014, 11:46 AM
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Looks like a big A3 Sedan.
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  #22  
Old 10-25-2014, 01:38 PM
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Audi sedan design has been a little too static for too long imho.
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  #23  
Old 10-25-2014, 02:30 PM
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They need something as perfectly different as the first A4 was from the ungainly 80/90. They won't of course because German car design ethic is to produce something that is only the slightest change.

Producing something that is as transformative as the current Kia Optima has been over its boring predecessor would be nice.
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  #24  
Old 10-26-2014, 08:54 PM
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Originally Posted by swizzle View Post
Producing something that is as transformative as the current Kia Optima has been over its boring predecessor would be nice.
Designed by former Audi designer "Peter Schreyer" ;)
The best designer Audi ever had.
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  #25  
Old 10-27-2014, 12:34 AM
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Designed by former Audi designer "Peter Schreyer" ;)
The best designer Audi ever had.
And I will guarantee you he has more creative freedom at Hyundai/Kia without a fuhrer like Piech mucking around. Schreyer's oversight of their whole ball of wax is producing good results. The new Sonata and Genesis look inoffensive in pictures, but in person they are sophisticated and quite attractive...especially the Genesis.

Last edited by swizzle; 10-27-2014 at 12:36 AM.
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  #26  
Old 10-27-2014, 02:10 PM
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[...]but in person they are sophisticated and quite attractive...especially the Genesis.
This tells more about yourself than about Schreyer.
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  #27  
Old 10-27-2014, 02:33 PM
mick78 mick78 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swizzle View Post
And I will guarantee you he has more creative freedom at Hyundai/Kia without a fuhrer like Piech mucking around. Schreyer's oversight of their whole ball of wax is producing good results. The new Sonata and Genesis look inoffensive in pictures, but in person they are sophisticated and quite attractive...especially the Genesis.
http://www.carscoops.com/2014/10/us-...5-hyundai.html

At least concerning the Sonata, the market doesn't seem to agree with you.

Personally, I don't think that these Hyundais are where Audi should go, to me they seem like customer clinics products, the least offensive design chosen. And Audi, both where their aim is (to be a technical leader) and where their price is, needs more than that. Something new, modern yet timeless, outstanding.

Unfortunately, with the super conservative and preference for LED and chrome bling China becoming the way most important luxury car market, I see little chance for a real outstanding premium design too soon (same goes for the evolutionary approaches of BMW and Jaguar and the upcoming "am I a C or S-Class?" E-Class Mercedes...)
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  #28  
Old 10-27-2014, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mick78 View Post
http://www.carscoops.com/2014/10/us-...5-hyundai.html

At least concerning the Sonata, the market doesn't seem to agree with you.

Personally, I don't think that these Hyundais are where Audi should go, to me they seem like customer clinics products, the least offensive design chosen. And Audi, both where their aim is (to be a technical leader) and where their price is, needs more than that. Something new, modern yet timeless, outstanding.

Unfortunately, with the super conservative and preference for LED and chrome bling China becoming the way most important luxury car market, I see little chance for a real outstanding premium design too soon (same goes for the evolutionary approaches of BMW and Jaguar and the upcoming "am I a C or S-Class?" E-Class Mercedes...)
Not to get too off-topic, but the sales re: the Sonata that you mention have been refuted to a certain extent.

Sales in October 2014 were apparently up more than 7% compared to October 2013. Additionally:

We reached out to Hyundai Motor America's Jim Trainor, national manager of product public relations, and he strenuously argued in-depth against many of the claims made in the Reuters story, telling Autoblog that it's too early to judge the Sonata's success, as the entire range hasn't even made it to dealers yet. He may have a point.

"All along, we had planned for a phased rollout to be sure we were delivering high-quality cars to our dealers and customers right off the bat. For the first month, we began this ramp up with just the 2.4-liter models before we introduced the 2.0-liter turbos," says Trainor. "Additionally, the all-new 1.6-liter turbo models are just now being shipped to dealers. We are right on track where we wanted to be while delivering the highest quality Sonatas possible."


http://www.autoblog.com/2014/10/23/h...-sales-report/
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  #29  
Old 10-27-2014, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by mick78 View Post

Personally, I don't think that these Hyundais are where Audi should go...

That's not what I said. I said that Audi needs something as "game-changingly" different as the current Optima (Schreyer's) was over the previous one.

My parenthetical point--apparently not made clearly--about the Hyundais is that Schreyer has dialed back the Sci-Fi looks and made both the Sonata and Genesis more tasteful.

As for the Sonata's sales, it could simply be that the competition is incentivizing more. You can get a Camry locally for 0% financing for 72 months, for example.
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  #30  
Old 10-28-2014, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swizzle View Post
That's not what I said. I said that Audi needs something as "game-changingly" different as the current Optima (Schreyer's) was over the previous one.

My parenthetical point--apparently not made clearly--about the Hyundais is that Schreyer has dialed back the Sci-Fi looks and made both the Sonata and Genesis more tasteful.

As for the Sonata's sales, it could simply be that the competition is incentivizing more. You can get a Camry locally for 0% financing for 72 months, for example.
Ok, I do agree about the need for game changing different. Audi is desperately in need of that. The A3 was lame, even today I need to look twice to tell if it is a new one. And it appears the A4 will be even lamer. I'm not so certain the new Sonata is more tasteful, or just more vanilla. To me , that's a different story, and I tend towards the second.

The Camry example you bring up is interesting and just shows how, apart form car sizes and engine and transmission preferences, the US market is different form Europe. In Europe it always seems that ultimately the product is more important, we do have sales and extra warranties as well, but they never seem to have the same market impact. If a bestseller (what the Sonata is) gets renewed, no way a 0% finance on another model could seriously affect sales. People would still fly towards the new (well unless the new model is a total failure).
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